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  • acescracked
    acescracked Posts: 1,197 Chairperson of the Boards

    @Bad said:
    Monkey and Riri are a good duo against chasm.
    It's needed to equip all AP boosts, yes.
    There will be damage, yes.
    But they can kill the zombies comfortably as they don't share the same colors and riri can delay chasm the tiny bit of time needed to finally collect AP and play the game at last.

    So all the doom & gloom you've been posting about is over?

  • Bad
    Bad Posts: 3,146 Chairperson of the Boards

    @acescracked said:

    So all the doom & gloom you've been posting about is over?

    I'm still waiting for the character totally countering chasm. Preventing/compensating AP lost and immune to stun on the first turn.
    I'm not asking for something outside the human knowledge, I think.

  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 7,019 Chairperson of the Boards

    A hard counter would be a character that Chasm teams can't beat, the same way that Hulk teams can't beat Scarlet Witch.

  • Bowgentle
    Bowgentle Posts: 7,926 Chairperson of the Boards

    @dianetics said:
    You need a character that punishes stun, punishes ap reduction, and punishes damage from powers, oh and one that also heals.

    There are other ways to attack meta characters than attacking all of their strengths. Identify the main ability that makes them powerful/annoying and overly punish that.

    Hard to do when his main complaint is the sheer existence of Chasm.

  • Bad
    Bad Posts: 3,146 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited January 2023

    @Bowgentle said:

    Hard to do when his main complaint is the sheer existence of Chasm.

    On the chahulk team thread chasm's defenders were really happy because chasm neutralizes SC (it sounds of something to you?).
    So correct me if I wrong. SC deserves all the right to be neutralized along the 95% of the remain characters. But chasm not.
    Can you enlighten me about the reason behind this argument, please?
    Or you, @dianetics .

  • DAZ0273
    DAZ0273 Posts: 11,516 Chairperson of the Boards

    Did SC need neutralizing then? I thought he was a delightful retal and/or tasty snack on a climb? I can't keep track these days. I long for the days when Odin was gonna be a defensive meta! ;)

  • Bowgentle
    Bowgentle Posts: 7,926 Chairperson of the Boards

    @DAZ0273 said:
    Did SC need neutralizing then? I thought he was a delightful retal and/or tasty snack on a climb? I can't keep track these days. I long for the days when Odin was gonna be a defensive meta! ;)

    Nah but it's nice that you don't get Shang Cheesed to death with a 450 Cheesy Boy and 0/5/0 Valk anymore, regardless of what team you're running.

  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 7,019 Chairperson of the Boards

    Wanting anyone to be nerfed is a betrayal of your fellow players. They all know he's too good, but you're not supposed to be competing against them -- we're all supposed to be cooperating against the evil developers. Hurting one player hurts us all!!!1!!!!1!

    I made the first "nerf Gambit" thread here, a few weeks after his release, and I got death threats! Now, most players who lived through Gambit admit that he needed to be fixed.

    Keep fighting the good fight. I'll get back to oneshotting Chasm with boosted Surfer or Wasp or whatever other old dumb guy they buff next.

  • Bowgentle
    Bowgentle Posts: 7,926 Chairperson of the Boards

    @entrailbucket said:
    Wanting anyone to be nerfed is a betrayal of your fellow players. They all know he's too good, but you're not supposed to be competing against them -- we're all supposed to be cooperating against the evil developers. Hurting one player hurts us all!!!1!!!!1!

    I made the first "nerf Gambit" thread here, a few weeks after his release, and I got death threats! Now, most players who lived through Gambit admit that he needed to be fixed.

    Keep fighting the good fight. I'll get back to oneshotting Chasm with boosted Surfer or Wasp or whatever other old dumb guy they buff next.

    Most of us were there in that thread with you.
    Mostly because it was so boring to play Gambit vs Gambit.

    Now, Chasm... there are options against him, he's not showing up every week cause god boosts exist, and mirror matches require more skill than "wait for enemy Gamit to fire red, fire your own red twice, win".
    So I don't think Chasm is on a Gambit or Bishop level of "please nerf now".

    Do I prefer the non-Chasm boost weeks? Sure.
    But he's not that big of a problem that we need to talk nerfs in every thread.

    Also, you forgot to mention slaps in faces.

  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 7,019 Chairperson of the Boards

    Eh, that's revisionist. I can dig up the link to that thread but it wasn't a terribly popular take at that time. Some people got particularly unhinged about it, but a lot of folks were just opposed to any nerf happening to any character.

    Also...people keep bringing Chasm up because he's too good, and he's everywhere. I still very much doubt they'll do anything about him (at least, anytime within the next year or so) but I understand why he gets talked about so much.

  • Bowgentle
    Bowgentle Posts: 7,926 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited January 2023

    I checked that thread now, just to make sure I remember right about being pro-nerf lol.
    https://forums.d3go.com/discussion/68924/please-nerf-5-gambit/p1

  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 7,019 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited January 2023

    "French card dork" is still some of my very best work.

    It's pretty funny how all of the pro-nerf and anti-nerf comments are exactly the same, no matter which character you're talking about. In Gambit's case it is now generally accepted that he was overpowered and oppressive, and the debate looks exactly like the Chasm debate.

  • Bad
    Bad Posts: 3,146 Chairperson of the Boards

    @dianetics said:

    There are other ways to attack meta characters than attacking all of their strengths. Identify the main ability that makes them powerful/annoying and overly punish that.

    Nice. And if he drains all your AP how will you overpunish that? With which character you overpunish it? Is it designed yet?
    By the way, I talked too soon. Riri's stun is too short and even equipping all AP I can win if there are cascades and some luck.
    It's better with SW.

  • Bad
    Bad Posts: 3,146 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited January 2023

    @dianetics said:
    Don’t derp out on me here. Let me quote myself from this thread.
    “They could just figure out a way to punish revives passively. Something that compounds quickly and after a few revives either massively reduce enemy damage, increase damage against the opponent, or converts a percentage of damage to permanent health damage. With the number increasing after each revive.”

    His revive paired with ihulks revive is the major issue right now. So punish multiple revives with a passive ability.

    Just get hit monkeys team up working properly and many of these issues will fall away quickly

    However I quoted what you just said. It wasn't me, at least I don't have access toyour account. Better to quote a comment that you posted today than a comment from 4 months, don't you think? ;)

    Do you really believe the revive part is the major issue? Devs should think likewise after releasing 2 characters downing revivers forever.

  • revskip
    revskip Posts: 1,146 Chairperson of the Boards

    I finally had a really long annoying Chasm match in my MMR. Mostly because I was using the defensive spec (5/5/3) in a mirror match, definitely won't do that again. If you run him 5/3/5 for the extra damage matches run pretty fast even against multiple revivers. Especially when running him with Emma and Dr Thor in a boost week. Decidedly slower when running him with She/Hulk or iHulk.

    There is always going to be a best team to run during a boost week, this week there are a few centered around Chasm all of whom are better against the third. They bring Dr. Thor, you bring Emma. They bring Emma you can go either Dr. Thor who plays much better in a user's hands than AI or She-Hulk. Against iHulk/She-Hulk you bring Dr. Thor for the yellow that can take both out in the same turn. Oscorp Spidey is great this week too, his red can quickly neutralize a defensive built Chasm by blowing up all his web tiles. The only odd duck that I haven't found a great use this week in PvP for is Kamala because she needs someone who helps with specials to shine.

  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 7,019 Chairperson of the Boards

    @dianetics said:
    Don’t derp out on me here. Let me quote myself from this thread.
    “They could just figure out a way to punish revives passively. Something that compounds quickly and after a few revives either massively reduce enemy damage, increase damage against the opponent, or converts a percentage of damage to permanent health damage. With the number increasing after each revive.”

    His revive paired with ihulks revive is the major issue right now. So punish multiple revives with a passive ability.

    Just get hit monkeys team up working properly and many of these issues will fall away quickly

    Why not just have a guy that passively turns off revive mechanics? Take Hit-Monkey's weird conditional red ability, stick it on a passive, and call it a day.

    My other best idea is a guy with a passive that converts all void tiles to basic tiles every turn.

    Both of these characters would have to have other useful/powerful abilities though, they couldn't only have those passives or they'd be too weak.

  • HoundofShadow
    HoundofShadow Posts: 8,004 Chairperson of the Boards

    Let's wait for the dev to turn Chasm's Abyss tiles from character tiles to special tiles and you'll be able to pair him with KK. Throw in mThor/Emma for more random passive damage. I don't mind the dev categorising his Abyss tiles as special tiles now.

  • Bowgentle
    Bowgentle Posts: 7,926 Chairperson of the Boards

    @HoundofShadow said:
    Let's wait for the dev to turn Chasm's Abyss tiles from character tiles to special tiles and you'll be able to pair him with KK. Throw in mThor/Emma for more random passive damage. I don't mind the dev categorising his Abyss tiles as special tiles now.

    There's absolutely zero indication that they intend to do that.
    Web tiles aren't special tiles, either.

  • HoundofShadow
    HoundofShadow Posts: 8,004 Chairperson of the Boards

    You spoke too soon. They did it for Wong stealthily. Check SourCream's video in his thread. His red counts Abyss and Web tiles as special tiles.

    I went to test matching Abyss tiles with Mantis and Morbius after that but it doesn't work.

    So, it's either a bug or Wong's got special privilege.

  • Bowgentle
    Bowgentle Posts: 7,926 Chairperson of the Boards

    Sigh.
    BCS is about as consistent as Demi was apparently.
    Hopefully this will not be a one-char-only thing.

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